Here is a 1967 Indian release of Ali Akbar Khan. I believe our friend Tawfiq at 'oriental-traditional-music' posted a copy of this in 2015. I have compared my version and found it brighter with more upper frequencies, which adds a nice clarity. I ordered this LP from the Ukraine... so not only was I happy that it actually made it all the way to Australia, it also looked unplayed, so a great opportunity to digitise it in its prime! It's truly a joy to find these 50 year old records in such great condition. A fairly relaxed rendition of Raga Medhavi and a nice rendition of Bairagi. The technical accuracy stands out nicely into the faster passages.
Label: His Master's Voice – EASD 1319
Tracks:
A - Raga Medhavi (Short Alap & Vilambit Gat in Teentaal)
B - Raga Bairagi (Short Alap, Gats in Taal Shashanka & Fast Gat in Teentaal)
Digitised with: Project Essential II Turntable, Ortofon Red Stylus, recorded as WAV 16/48 in Audacity and saved unaltered (apart from track separation/info tags) as FLAC, and then separately edited with: Clickrepair (low settings) then slight reduction on surface noise + normalised to -1.5db in Audacity and exported as FLAC and MP3 320kbps.
Three posts today and each offers a lossless gift? I'm looking forward to an evening full of enjoyment. Thank you so much!
ReplyDeleteWelcome yotte. Thanks so much for listening.
ReplyDeleteThanks again for this. I believe that my friend Tawfiq has basically posted almost all of the Ali Akbar Khan LPs in existence except for a small handful. Bolingo69 on his legendary blog has also posted a healthy number. My own humble blog features some rare live recordings, and there are literally dozens of audio only concerts available on the youtube. That doesn't count, of course the something-like 8,000 hours of concerts and instruction housed at the charming house in San Rafael, CA which houses the Ali Akbar College of Music.
ReplyDeleteI have spoken to both Mary Khan and Alam Khan about the present plans of reissuing the LPs. Mostly they had been focused for about 10 years on opening the AACM library, which allows anyone with an interest, two ears, and the ability to get to San Rafael the opportunity to listen to their treasure trove of recordings.
There was for a long time some problems with reissue rights (which can be a nightmare), but these seem to have been mostly resolved. It seems that original master recordings for some (many?) EMI records are no longer existent, unfortunately. It reminds me of the 1000s of film negatives for Bollywood films which were melted down in the 1950s to provide a cheap source of colorful plastic to make ladies' handbags.
As just a modicum of unsolicited advice, you may find that the capabilities of a stand-alone program such as ClickRepair are far far superior to using the plug ins for Audacity for such things. The clearest and most helpful feature of ClickRepair (which I think costs about $20 for a license) is the ability to listen to the before noise reduction, after noise reduction, or just only the noise which has been removed, all in real time by pressing simple buttons. I listen very carefully to each of the tracks when I use it -- if anything starts to sound like it might contain the barest hint of musical information (such as rhythmic fuzzy squeaks) i check it out and adjust downward to allow more "noise" in so that whatever the source (often the higher frequencies of tabla) are not lost.
Finally, presenting these masterpieces and treasures of human cultural achievement are best when providing the highest resolution possible, so that it is easier for yourself or others in the future to make more precise and unobtrusive "cleanups" or other adjustments such as corrections of speed or voltage changes during the recording session. The technology will continue to improve but more resolution in the transfer means more precision adjustment.
Keep up the good work. Take your time. Maintaining a good pace has been the biggest challenge I've faced as a blogger.
Thanks so much for your message. It certainly would be a shame if any of these original tapes were lost or not stored correctly as I could imagine. If only Ali Akbar's LPs were reissued in the same manner as Ravi Shankar's on the Angel Records label, whose original masters were kept somewhere safe - so many more people could have accessed this music.
DeleteOther bloggers - especially Tawfiq have indeed done a fantastic job, and certainly have provided me with much comfort whilst waiting for my own copies of the original vinyls. I do find though Tawfiq's set-up through an external pre-amp and amp (I presume) makes these digitisations sound a bit mellow or 'warm' coloured. Also I have noticed many, if not all of these posts have the left and right channels swapped when I've compared them to the original vinyls - maybe a cable mix up? I use a fairly great stylus and record direct from in-built pre-amp to USB in WAV - which usually gives a clearer brighter result. This is why I may happen to re-post some of these already posted LPs.
The advice about the program is very helpful. I think I will start uploading the unaltered WAVs so that there is always a 'master tape' out there, so to say! I notice that Flat Black Classical offers digitisations in 24bit quality. Though I have a great stylus on my turntable that gives an accurate tracing of the grooves, I think I will need to re-digitise my collection in the future when I upgrade to the even higher-end Ortofon Blue, as well as a turntable upgrade that may further reduce any inherent hums or vibrations from the motor (I'm eyeing something made from carbon!) - in that case it would make much more sense to wait before recording in 24bit 48k, as the information will be even better picked up physically in the transfer. Sorry about the turntable rambling.. these devices are just so fascinating! - and the technology available now makes vinyl even more enjoyable.
Finally it's always the small quotes that stick in the mind and help us in life the greatest... and that was 'Take your time'. A great suggestion and just what I needed.
Dear Kirrin.
DeleteI ABSOLUTELY agree with Richards comments regarding ClickRepair and I use nothing else these days. If you still have the unaltered WAV files for your previous blogs still available, I would lovingly encourage you to please make them available to the world. It's great to know that some people in the world care about the quality of the older and priceless & timeless recordings of the grand masters of Indian classical music.
LJF
I think I will just make the unaltered version available from now on. I have downloaded Clickrepair but it seems to be somewhat clunky. I can somehow import and get an end file, but there is no preview or visuals of the sound waves showing up in the program... Any advice? I have installed java.
DeleteHi Kirrin,
DeleteSorry for the long comment, esp. since I doubt this is what you had in mind when you asked about advice. :) I'm on a Mac and here is my standard procedure when transferring my own LPs. It seems like I never find this sort of information elsewhere, so I hope it is helpful. Please take this for what it's worth and know that it's only an example offered by a grateful but technically-challenged music lover and nothing more.
I record with Audacity in 32bit float, 96k. After trimming the beginning/end of the LP side, Normalize to remove DC offset (without affecting maximum amplitude); Find Zero Crossings & Align tracks to Zero; Export Audio as AIFF Signed 32-bit PCM.
Next, I run it through Click Repair with the following settings (this sometimes varies if the LP is in poor condition):
Automatic: All
DeClick: 10
Method: Wavelet
Pitch Protection (checked)
Reverse (checked)
I'm not suggesting that these settings are the best, only that I find they offer an excellent compromise for effort vs. results. With these settings, I've not noticed any compromise in high frequencies and the benefit of the clicks removed is outstanding. Full disclosure - I'm in my early 50's now so my hearing may not be what it was a few years ago.
I then import the click repaired file into Audacity; Normalize (without removing DC Offset) to bring up the peaks to -0.9 db.; Find appropriate places and Add labels to mark the track divisions; Export Multiple (again in 32bit, 96k).
Finally, I use XLS to tag the files and Export Audio as either FLAC or Apple Lossless in 24bit, 96k. These are the final files that I archive.
I'd strongly recommend archiving and posting 24/96 in either FLAC or Apple Lossless compression. I think you'll find it results in a much better sounding archive at approximately the same size file as WAV or AIFF uncompressed files. Some sites I visit offer 24bit 192k files but they're so huge that I personally do not find them attractive - too little bang for the buck.
In the last paragraph, I meant to say 'I think you'll find it results in a much better sounding archive at approximately the same size file as 16/44 WAV or AIFF uncompressed files.
DeleteThat’s really helpful. I thought the file size on 24/96 was a lot bigger. I give it a test maybe on the next post. If I get clickrepair working properly on my computer I’ll give these settings a go. I’ve only tried to import WAV. Maybe I’ll try to use an AIFF and see it that works.
DeleteI may have misspoken about the file sizes. I just browsed a number of single lp 24/96 flac zips and found that most were between 750mb and 900mb.
DeleteHello
DeleteHaving read the above comments I thought I'd add my own thoughts, for what they are worth. Regarding files sizes, FLAC is compressed and generally 1/3 to 1/2 the size of a corresponding WAV file (though audio quality is identical). Increasing the sampling rate and word length will of course always lead to an increased file size as more 0's and 1's are needed. Whether it makes much difference is a personal matter.
The quality of digitisation of LP's will be highly dependent on the hardware used, both to play the LP and at the digitisation stage. Then of course what you do with the recording afterwards will also affect the results. So its difficult to generalise. I've never been able to hear any difference between 192 and 96 kHz sampling, but 96 often seems better than the standard 44 kHz used for CD's (I admit I am at the higher end of the age bracket though).
My personal inclination is to do as little to the recorded signal re post-processing as is possible. The removal of clicks using ClickRepair may well remove a small amount of musical information, as its really hard to decide algorithmically what is music and what is noise. But in my experience it does an excellent job if used carefully. It may not work on the really huge scratches, but Audacity can get rid of these quite easily when used in manual mode. If the worst comes to the worst, the crack can be simply cut out. Such cracks occur over a very small time interval and removing 0.05 secs of music is generally completely inaudible, though its not something one would normally want to do.
Finally, as far as a slight loss of high frequency after use of ClickRepair goes, I just note that the sharp signals associated with pops/clicks occur over a short time interval and get transformed by our ears into high frequency sounds. Their removal therefore might give the erroneous impression of high frequency loss, but all that is really lost is high frequency noise.
Regards Louis
Hi Louis. I have to say I've never been on the FLAC bandwagon. I prefer to work in WAV only. Your comments have been really helpful in getting me to investigate further into the technicalities of digital recording. Although I have done some beginner audio recording courses at university, I think it does take a long time to get your head around all the maths and concepts. It seems maybe worth it to start uploading unaltered WAV in 16/48 so others can edit to their own preferences. Size and traffic limits on my dropbox mean I can't include the 24/96 anyway. However I did some tests: to get 24/96 recording I need to revert to the RCA connection from preamp into my Native Instruments Komplete Audio 6 interface (a fairly well regarded USB based Digital Audio Interface for recording microphones etc.) - whereas currently my method of direct to USB from pre-amp is limited to 16/48. Comparing the two, the USB direct to WAV just sounded more balanced and better on the ear - the ultimate reference point. on top of that even though I would be recording in the recommended 24/96 in the other set-up, there is risk of interference from the RCA cables (a huge debate in itself - why on earth would an unbalanced inferior cable ever become the standard for hifi commercial audio appliances...?!) as well as manual adjustments and judgement of the gain controls - I'm quite sure even when I have both gain controls in the same position the levels aren't even on both sides... sigh.
DeleteDear Kirrin
DeleteThe reason that FLAC (and other lossless digital audio formats) are so popular compared with WAV is that they are compressed, but have identical sound quality. However, their file size is much smaller, so better for sharing and also for personal archiving. I store all my digital computer files as FLAC files (most are taken from CD's).
I personally do not have a vast collection of Indian LP's, so I don't have a great experience in digitising them. I'm limited to 16/44 digitisation since I use an external ADC which has that limitation. Someday soon I may get a better one. Most of my Indian LP's are quite recent purchases of musical material which was/is not available on CD, but also some music that was dreadfully treated by Saregama engineers. I now listen almost exclusively to the computer stored files via my streamer to the hifi system.
I have recently started downloading LP digitisations from web sources like your own excellent one. For those sites which offer the raw unprocessed digitisations, I treat then with the software ClickRepair which can only read uncompressed formats like WAV. That is no problem however, as its easy to convert FLAC to WAV and back again. I don't use Audacity to do any signal processing other than saving headers and splicing LP sides into the original tracks. I am not at all impressed with the "noise reduction" and click fixing in Audacity (otherwise a great program). Noise reduction ALWAYS results in some musical loss and the Saregama engineers are very fond of excessive use of it. One way of picking up the use of noise reduction on these CD's is to listen to the tambura, which becomes very unnatural in sound, almost electronic. The worst examples are the transfers of 78RPM music to CD, whereby the use of noise reduction is so excessive that the music also has virtually disappeared with the noise!
Scientifically its very hard to automate the distinction between noise and music, its really a subjective thing. Much of the noise from LP's is pops and clicks from dirt in the LP grooves, playing on poor quality turntable systems and sometimes from the original manufacturing process (e.g. using old stamps, cheap vinyl, etc). These pops are really very well removed with ClickRepair which usually has a benign effect on the music. Other noise like low frequency rumble, and noise from poor quality vinyl, is very difficult to remove without also adversely affecting the music.
Hope I havent bored you with this long reply.
Best wishes Louis
PS I've been listening here (India) to the excellent LP's that you put up from AAK. I downloaded them as MP3 onto my computer as Im sure I couldn't hear any difference on the poor sound I get. Once I'm back in UK I'll get your WAV downloads
Your comments are always welcome Louis! I have been digitising for about 2 years and have developed an approach that I have been pretty happy with (and I am quite picky with quality). My tendency recently has been to use sound reduction sparingly - after all it is called 'sound reduction', not sound removal... I've had some good results on the Nikhil Banerjee albums using a low setting in Clickrepair also. I always reference the tanpura and try to avoid any edits that might affect it. Sometimes the quality of the actual recording is not so great and the tanpura becomes quite weak, especially on some of the earlier 60's pressings which were most likely recorded several earlier. This has happened on a couple of the AAK albums - the vinyls are in great condition but the recording was just not that great.. or like you said defective in the pressing process. I intend to redigitise all the January posts into unaltered WAV, as I have recently cleaned a lot of them in a submersed spin clean.
Deletethank you so much for your EXCELLENT selection. I too really appreciate the higher resolution on these hard to find LPs. Music for the next 100 years ; )
ReplyDeleteYou're welcome. Thank you
DeleteThank you for the quality ! It's a pleasure to discover your LP's
ReplyDeleteThank you very much, enjoy
DeleteMany thanks Kirrin.
ReplyDeleteIt is heartwarming to see someone taking such care to preserve and tease out the best quality sound from the great heritage of recorded classical music of India. I tried my hand at sound editing some years ago and recently 'rediscovered' a cache of folders I had shared on mediafire about 9 years ago, which, to my amazement, was still available there. It represents a portion of the ICM I have been collecting since about 1968 or so. The links to this collection are large so I am not sure how to make them available to anyone. Perhaps if you were to email me at reedr99@hotmail.com I could respond with the urls as an attachment?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, many thanks for your efforts, and take care.
Rod
Hi Kirrin,
ReplyDeleteHaven't seen any updates from July 2018.
Hope all is well at your end !
cheers,
PS.
Thank you for sharing the beautiful music!!!
ReplyDeleteThank you !
ReplyDelete